What might I be doing wrong?

RhodesRhodes Posts: 1,584Member
I fot through four 1st strings in a day, and wonder if there is anything obvious that I might be doing wrong? I restrung my guitar with those dreadful D'Addario things, and the following say the first string broke close to the bridge. I wasn't thrashing it at all, and there seem to be no rough edges on the saddles. I therefore changed the string with one of my quickly dwindling stock of spares, and that broke right by the tuner, as did the next one I tried. The next time was successful, and has been in place for, oh, 36 hours now.

I didn't overtighten the string - just tuned it to pitch (perhaps just a little over) and stretched it and re-tuned a few times, but it was as if the string was cutting in to itself a bit too much.

It had never happended before.

Comments

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    I don't like D'adds much; my claim that I've not broken a string in 10 years or so relies on me ignoring them. Of course, then Dean Markley had to inflict his horrible Blue Steels on me.

    Sounds to me like you just got some bad strings, if you're sure that the bridge doesn't have any burrs on it.
  • RhodesRhodes Posts: 1,584Member
     Quote:
    Originally posted by andira:
    I don't like D'adds much; my claim that I've not broken a string in 10 years or so relies on me ignoring them. Of course, then Dean Markley had to inflict his horrible Blue Steels on me.

    Sounds to me like you just got some bad strings, if you're sure that the bridge doesn't have any burrs on it.


    I don't think that there are any burrs. I had a pretty good look and can't see anything. And that wouldn't explain those that broke at the other end. Perhaps they are just from a bad batch. I got the spares from Regent in a job lot of 10. Most are marked Peavey.

    I'll have to make sure that it's not the guitar before I switch to Elixirs or something. I might just buy WYNIRO's magic juice. Er, for want of a better expression.
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    To be fair to D'addarios I've used them for 2 years now on all 5 of my guitars and I've never broken one.

    The guy I know who runs a string retailers actually says that for the money D'addarios are the best quality string you can get. His opinion of Ernie Balls is that they trade on their name and the list of celeb endorsers and attempt to charge as high a price as they can for a relatively low quality string.


    If you can also check out D'arco strings, they're made by Martin, cheep as chips and pretty damn good.
  • Options
     Quote:
    Originally posted by Rhodes:


    WYNIRO's magic juice.


  • LooseMooseLooseMoose Posts: 1,716Member
    It's always worth not going right up to pitch when stringing a guitar...

    If you tune everything a whole tone down and then bring the strings individually up to concert pitch, you may find you will break less...

    I doubt it's D'addario strings per se - But if you have the packaging, get in touch with them - they'll take a number from the pack and you MAY get a replacement set (or sets) - Worth an email...

    Also, if they are breaking at the machinehead end, it's worth looking at your stringing technique - do you use the 'guitarist' magazine method of bending the string right round? If so, that could be your problem...

    Cheers,
    James
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     Quote:
    Originally posted by WYNIR0:
    The guy I know who runs a string retailers actually says that for the money D'addarios are the best quality string you can get. His opinion of Ernie Balls is that they trade on their name and the list of celeb endorsers and attempt to charge as high a price as they can for a relatively low quality string.


    Really? Is that who I think it is? He certainly seems to know his stuff; it's just that I've never had a problem with EBs, but I've broken quite a few D'Adds... Ah well. Probably just bad luck on my part.
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    yep, it'd be who you suspect. I think it's safe to say that he doesn't have the best relationship with EB's uk distributer for reasons I won;t go into.

    [ 25 June 2003: Message edited by: WYNIR0 ]
  • RhodesRhodes Posts: 1,584Member
     Quote:
    Originally posted by LooseMoose:
    It's always worth not going right up to pitch when stringing a guitar...

    If you tune everything a whole tone down and then bring the strings individually up to concert pitch, you may find you will break less...

    I doubt it's D'addario strings per se - But if you have the packaging, get in touch with them - they'll take a number from the pack and you MAY get a replacement set (or sets) - Worth an email...

    Also, if they are breaking at the machinehead end, it's worth looking at your stringing technique - do you use the 'guitarist' magazine method of bending the string right round? If so, that could be your problem...

    Cheers,
    James


    Thank you. I did use a method of stringing from Guitarist of one of its sister magazines - cutting the string a bit long, pocking it just through the hole, and then wrapping the string round both under and over the protruding bit of string and then winding like a demon. Perhaps I do need to find another way of doing it.

    Unfortunately, I do not understand the much-admired Peter Allen way of doing it.
  • Options
     Quote:
    Originally posted by Rhodes:
    Thank you. I did use a method of stringing from Guitarist of one of its sister magazines - cutting the string a bit long, pocking it just through the hole, and then wrapping the string round both under and over the protruding bit of string and then winding like a demon.


    Huh? I have no idea how that works.

    I turn the tuning key until the hole in the machinehead is in line with the neck, then take the string past the machinehead, loop round and through the hole. I usually end up with 1-2 turns on the lower strings, maybe 3 on the higher, and the tuning stability this way seems to be perfect, even on the Talman with serious trem abuse.
  • nadnad Posts: 1,983Member
    I schmell a conspiracy with whirly and andi.
  • RhodesRhodes Posts: 1,584Member
     Quote:
    Originally posted by andira:


    Huh? I have no idea how that works.

    I turn the tuning key until the hole in the machinehead is in line with the neck, then take the string past the machinehead, loop round and through the hole. I usually end up with 1-2 turns on the lower strings, maybe 3 on the higher, and the tuning stability this way seems to be perfect, even on the Talman with serious trem abuse.


    Through the hole from which direction? And what sort of length of string do you allow for winding?

    This really is something I ought to know, but I am sure that I am not the only one to benefit from the advice. I might have misunderstood the advice from the magazine.
  • nadnad Posts: 1,983Member
     Quote:
    Originally posted by Rhodes:


    Through the hole from which direction? And what sort of length of string do you allow for winding?


    I tend to leave about under a cm over the distance between 2 machine heads when leaving the string for the wraparounds.. about an inch? if not then you could always rap it round twice (and half) , see where that comes to, and then poke it through and then turn.. and turn.. and turn.. and turn..

    Oh, and don't forget to turn :) .
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     Quote:
    Originally posted by Rhodes:
    Through the hole from which direction? And what sort of length of string do you allow for winding?


    Through the hole away from the body. So that the string goes 3/4 of the way around the tuning peg, then into the hole.

    I don't allow any real slack in the string; I use one hand to keep it fairly taught - obviously not enough tension for it to do anything but flap about vaguely. I've found that too many wraps really messes up the tuning stability, and this keeps it down to (as I think I said) 1-2 turns on the low strings and 2-3 on the higher ones. Then I cut off the excess about 4-5mm out of the other side of the hole.
  • RhodesRhodes Posts: 1,584Member
     Quote:
    Originally posted by andira:


    Through the hole away from the body. So that the string goes 3/4 of the way around the tuning peg, then into the hole.

    I don't allow any real slack in the string; I use one hand to keep it fairly taught - obviously not enough tension for it to do anything but flap about vaguely. I've found that too many wraps really messes up the tuning stability, and this keeps it down to (as I think I said) 1-2 turns on the low strings and 2-3 on the higher ones. Then I cut off the excess about 4-5mm out of the other side of the hole.


    So, on a guitar with all 6 tuners on one side, the string goes past the right of the tuners (with the guitar facing you and head up), you wind it round the capstan (is that the word?) anti-clockwise and poke it through the underneath of the hole, and then just wind? That seems a bit easy. Perhaps it is. \:\)
  • Options
    Yup; that's how I do it. Seems to work OK.
  • nadnad Posts: 1,983Member
     Quote:
    Originally posted by Rhodes:


    So, on a guitar with all 6 tuners on one side, the string goes past the right of the tuners (with the guitar facing you and head up), you wind it round the capstan (is that the word?) anti-clockwise and poke it through the underneath of the hole, and then just wind? That seems a bit easy. Perhaps it is. \:\)



    Hehehehe, that confused me, but lemme try and say in my words then tell me if its the same \:D .

    - Poke the string through the body --> bridge.
    - Turn the machine head so that the "pokey through hole" (POK for short) faces towards where the strings are coming from.
    - Then string it through with roughly about an inches worth of slack.
    - Turn the machinehead anticlockwise (away from the body, how you normally tune up)
    - Turn some more.
    - Probably some more turning.
    - Just an iccle more turning.
    - Do it so that the string is going to stay there, but isn't particularily in key, or anything like that, just so its there :) .
    - Do the same with the 5 other strings.
    - Tune up.

    Tah-Dah, that's what i do anyway, bear (grizzly.. arghhH!!!! ) that i'm in a posh office right now, guitarless ( \:\( ) and dat oim ded stoopid.

    \:\)

    If anyone wants to correct me, or shout abuse at me, or put me right, please tick here:
  • RhodesRhodes Posts: 1,584Member
    But that doesn't appear to take account of the constant exhortations to trap the string under itself, so it doesn't slip. Or does it? I think I have a mental block when it comes to guitar strings. And playing, unfortunately. \:\(
  • nadnad Posts: 1,983Member
     Quote:
    Originally posted by Rhodes:
    But that doesn't appear to take account of the constant exhortations to trap the string under itself, so it doesn't slip. Or does it? I think I have a mental block when it comes to guitar strings. And playing, unfortunately. \:\(


    Yeah, the little bugger does like to slide away occasionally, but I seem to have mastered this now, uhhhh just do what Andi (and you) said \:D .
  • Options
     Quote:
    Originally posted by nad:
    Hehehehe, that confused me, but lemme try and say in my words then tell me if its the same \:D .


    No - sounds like a decent method, but here's how I do it in a similar step-by-step format:

    - Poke the string through the body --> bridge.
    - Turn the machine head so that the "pokey through hole" (POK for short) faces towards where the strings are coming from.
    - Hold string against right edge of machinehead
    - Gently bend string around to the left, keep going until it's at the POK
    - Poke string through POK keeping some tension on it
    - On other side of POK, bend the string upwards (helps hold it in place)
    - Turn machinehead, making sure the string wraps on the machinehead are below the POK
    - Once at pitch and stretched, trim string

    Does that make sense?

    [ 25 June 2003: Message edited by: andira ]
  • nadnad Posts: 1,983Member
     Quote:
    Originally posted by andira:


    No - sounds like a decent method, but here's how I do it in a similar step-by-step format:

    - Poke the string through the body --> bridge.
    - Turn the machine head so that the "pokey through hole" (POK for short) faces towards where the strings are coming from.
    - Hold string against right edge of machinehead
    - Gently bend string around to the left, keep going until it's at the POK
    - Poke string through POK keeping some tension on it
    - On other side of POK, bend the string upwards (helps hold it in place)
    - Turn machinehead, making sure the string wraps on the machinehead are below the POK
    - Once at pitch and stretched, trim string

    Does that make sense?

    [ 25 June 2003: Message edited by: andira ]



    Ahh, I tend to poke it through POK and then bend it slightly where the inch of slack ends and it usually sits for me, but your method seems much better.

    /me pats andi on the head.
  • Options
     Quote:
    Originally posted by nad:
    Ahh, I tend to poke it through POK and then bend it slightly where the inch of slack ends and it usually sits for me, but your method seems much better.


    I think you probably end up with 1/2 a turn more on the machinehead than me, other than that it works out as pretty much the same, I reckon. I just find it easier to tighten the strings to pitch if there isn't a lot of slack on them already.

     Quote:
    /me pats andi on the head.


    Erm... cheers.
  • nadnad Posts: 1,983Member
     Quote:
    Originally posted by andira:
    Erm... cheers.


    As you can tell im bored at my work exp. place, done all my work today.

    Off at half four though 'cos thats what time my mums train comes in.. *looks at watch* sigh \:\(
  • Paladin2019Paladin2019 Posts: 1,607Member
    As we're in a list mood I'll post my interpretation of the Peter Allen method which stays in tune for days on end.

    - set "pokey thru hole", or POK, parallel with nut
    - poke string through POK right image" /> left (or left image" /> right on 3+3 top 3 strings)
    - pull string through the POK so that the slack allows it to lay on the nut slot 4 strings away ie. for the bottom E, the string rests over the B slot (about an inch away)
    - Kink the string portion coming out of the left side of the POK upwards and bring it round the post in a clockwise motion (again assuming you're working on the low strings of a 3+3 or any string on a 6-in-a-line headstock). When it meets the rest of the string, tuck it under and pull it tight with a downwards force (towards the bridge - this stops tangling problems)
    - Wind, making sure the windings go under each other and that the string you're pulling on follows the same angle relative to the hole as it goes around or you may get a tangle.
    -When done, stretch it as normal. Stretching now and not later means it'll be easier to tune up when you're finished.
    - Repeat for strings going through the A POK D POK G POK B POK and e POK. ;\)

    [ 12 August 2003: Message edited by: Paladin2019 ]
  • nadnad Posts: 1,983Member
     Quote:
    Originally posted by Paladin2019:
    As we're in a list mood I'll post my interpretation of the Peter Allen method which stays in tune for days on end.

    - set pokey thru hole parallel with nut
    - poke string through hole right image" /> left (or left image" /> right on 3+3 top 3 strings)
    - pull string through so that the slack allows it to lay on the nut slot 4 strings away ie. for the bottom E, the string rests over the B slot (about an inch away)
    - Kink the string portion on the left side of the hole upwards and bring it round the post in a clockwise motion. When it meets the rest of the string, tuck it under and pull it tight with a downwards force (towards the bridge - this stops tangling problems)
    - Wind


    I didn't see the use of the word POK .
  • Paladin2019Paladin2019 Posts: 1,607Member
     Quote:
    Originally posted by nad:


    I didn't see the use of the word POK .


    Editing now... :rolleyes:

    I can't be expected to care when I'm off to the US tomorrow!
  • nadnad Posts: 1,983Member
     Quote:
    Originally posted by Paladin2019:


    Editing now... :rolleyes:

    I can't be expected to care when I'm off to the US tomorrow!


    I just realised that POK doesnt stand for 'pokey through hole'

    \:D .
  • Options
    My guitar from regent came with a helpful photocopied sheet explaining peter's recommended stringing technique, fairly easy to understand. I dare say if you gave him a ring, he'd send you one...
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